Why did they messed with the pitch on their debut album as well as on Hatful of Hollow?

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doubled77 ®

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Post 11-Nov-2011 14:49

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Does anyone knows why they messed with the pitch on their debut album as well as on Hatful of Hollow? I mean it's not F#... it's close but songs have been slowed down or accelerated a bit.
Thanks!
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drew

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Post 20-Nov-2011 01:31 (after 8 days)

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My guess is to get within the confines of the limited Moz vocal range/comfort zone. Somewhere before Meat is Murder he took vocal lessons, which greatly increased his range.
It bugs me too; I have a pretty good ear for pitch and can tell when something's just ever so slightly off.
Having done my own corrections on a few tracks ("You Just Haven't Earned..." in particular), to A440 accuracy, the difference is astounding. Not only in actual pitch, but the drums/tonal quality as a whole is improved.
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egosheep

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Post 20-Nov-2011 21:38 (after 20 hours)

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Interesting. But wouldn't correcting the backing track to true pitch make the vocal track too high or low? If the backing tracks were slowed down or sped up to fit Morrissey's voice, it would seem that way.
I'd be interested in hearing your changes either way!
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doubled77 ®

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Post 21-Nov-2011 01:27 (after 3 hours)

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Well, I'm not talking about the F# vs E tuning (to accomodate Moz vocal range), I'm a bass player, when I tune to F# to play songs from their debut album and Hatful there is a slight difference in pitch and/or tempo. Songs on those albums have a slightly lower pitch than F# or they have been slowed down a bit. In my playback software (Ampeg SVX) I can change the pitch and I have to put a value of +4 so it match F#.
Also, when you listen to any live concerts they are perfect F#.
My guess is that whole songs (Moz + instruments) have been slowed down a bit. Why? That's what I don't get...
Anyway, was it possible in 1983 to slow down a recording without affecting the pitch?
I also like to play along The Chameleons John Peel session's and here same thing except I have to put a value of -2... songs seems to have been accelerate a tiny bit for a reason I'd like to know...
Looks like it was a common practice in the 80's to "mess" with the pitch and/or tempo (speed) of recordings...
Maybe Analog Loyalist could have the answer?
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drew

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Post 21-Nov-2011 01:38 (after 11 minutes)

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It's odd that the one commonality between all these listed observations, and my own with the Joy Division / New Order Peel recordings, is that the BBC sessions are the ones with pitch issues. There has to be some reason for this. I doubt we'll ever know the reason.
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rivum

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Post 28-Nov-2011 18:32 (after 7 days)

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Anyway, was it possible in 1983 to slow down a recording without affecting the pitch?
i don't think that's possible in any year.
stretch out any song and it will reduce the pitch.
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doubled77 ®

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Post 28-Nov-2011 18:52 (after 19 minutes)

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Well, in the software I use to playback audio tracks (Ampeg SVX) to play along a song, it is possible. I have two settings that I can play with, Pitch and Tempo. If I change the tempo, songs will keep the same pitch and if I change the pitch songs will keep the same tempo...
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DavidA

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Post 28-Nov-2011 19:24 (after 31 minute)

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Well, in the software I use to playback audio tracks (Ampeg SVX) to play along a song, it is possible. I have two settings that I can play with, Pitch and Tempo. If I change the tempo, songs will keep the same pitch and if I change the pitch songs will keep the same tempo...
Yes. That was worked out some time ago.
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doubled77 ®

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Post 28-Nov-2011 19:29 (after 5 minutes)

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??? What was worked out some time ago? Sorry english is not my primary language and sometimes I might miss something...
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DavidA

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Post 28-Nov-2011 21:09 (after 1 hour 40 minutes)

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I was agreeing with your comment. They worked out how to do it in the late 70s.
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doubled77 ®

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Post 28-Nov-2011 21:32 (after 22 minutes)

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Great! Thanks David!
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rivum

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Post 29-Nov-2011 16:09 (after 18 hours)

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well well well, i stand corrected!
thanks for the info davidA!
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georgethetwentythird

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Post 01-Dec-2011 14:16 (after 1 day 22 hours)

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Maybe Andy tuned to F#, but I always thought Johnny just used a capo :)
Tim
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egosheep

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Post 01-Dec-2011 14:34 (after 18 minutes)

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If you watch the early shows, Johnny is always tuned up to F#, he never used a capo live in the early days.
In the TQID era shows, he would use some guitars in standard tuning, some in F#. Andy did the same, he had some basses in E and some in F#.
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fab eberhard

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Post 04-Jan-2012 16:36 (after 1 month 3 days)

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one other perspective to add here... there are many obstacles present during the mastering process which are not always successfully worked out. it is not hard to believe that many recordings -esp. those on a budget - do not receive the scrutiny they deserve/require. i don't disbelieve anyone's comments here but there are always possibilities...
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